Teachers' Pay: Top Salaries For Top Performers?
A recently released analysis of teacher’s salaries in New York State for 2010-2011 showed that Scarsdale teachers are the highest paid teachers in the state, earning an average of $126,261 per year. Edgemont was also in the top ten, with average teacher salaries reported at $107,652. Westchester County has the highest average salaries in the state, with County teachers earning an average annual salary of $96,088.45. For these calculations the salaries are for teachers only, not administrators.
We spoke to Scarsdale Schools Superintendent Michael McGill about the salary data, and here is what he told us:
Scarsdale has offered highly competitive teacher salaries for decades, a practice that's been discussed at Board meetings, in other public forums and in publications. The objective has been to attract, hold and reward excellent teachers.
The number one ranking also goes back many years. An investment in teachers has seemed sound, especially in view of the salaries paid in other fields, like professional athletics. Further, past boards, and by extension, the community, have historically taken the view that salaries, and thus the quality of teachers we are able to hire, are the most important factor leading to the success of the Scarsdale school system and its students. Additionally, somewhat higher salaries have bought the district unusual flexibility with regard to contractual work rules.
The salary levels reflect many factors. Among them:
- The district tries to hire seasoned, proven teachers with excellent track records; it rarely hires people with little or no experience.
- Many teachers have advanced education beyond the MA, and the district creates financial incentives to encourage and reward professional growth throughout teachers' careers.
- Salary incentives are also used to reward master teachers and teacher experts for providing their colleagues with extensive mentoring, peer coaching and other extended professional development.
- A number of positions that would be classified as administrative in many districts are held part-time by teachers in Scarsdale. This reduces administrative costs -- Scarsdale has one of the lowest, per pupil, in the region -- but it also has a material impact on the level of teachers' salaries.
In the last round of negotiations, both the Board and the faculty organization recognized that Scarsdale risked getting too far out in front of the rest of the market and made a specific goal of bringing salaries into closer alignment with the top of the market. In its first year, the new contract began to reduce the disparity. However, the recession intervened. Salary growth in other districts flattened in ways nobody could have predicted, so that even with the $2 million plus reduction teachers took voluntarily in 2009 and 2010, salary growth in Scarsdale has been larger than growth elsewhere, relatively speaking, since the start of the recession. The size of the gap will be a priority in the next negotiations, which occur next year.
Comments (19)
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written by Calvin, November 20, 2011
It is a game of musical chairs or hot potatoes to me. We all know we like being here and hope somebody will buy our homes and the incredible tax burden on the school, town, and county levels. Music will stop soon thanks to state mandates, property tax cap, and Washington DC HUD suing Westchester so that it can continue to do social engineering so that we look more like Yonkers. We need to get over party affiliations, egos, and mind the store. Our kids are our most important legacy not country club membership or work awards. Bring home the bacon but be there to instill education and values lest we see them at Occupy Wall Street or leaving NY.
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written by Discouraged, November 19, 2011
Themes, Variations, Conclusions:
1. THEME: "I have kids in all three schools and have talked to many parents. There is not one parent I talk to that does not express frustration over the low performing teachers and keeping them around year after year, wasting our money, but mostly our children's precious youth."
VARIATION: I have been in all three schools and have talked to many teachers. There is not one teacher I talk to that does not express frustration over the low performing parents and keeping them around year after year, wasting their children's precious youth.
CONCLUSION: Parents shouldn't have tenure.
THEME: "3/4 of my kids' teachers are either good or outstanding. 1/4 are well below average, or bad, or so nasty they have no place in a classroom. And yet, they hang out there year after year, and we pay for them and their inflated pensions are their parting gift for decades to come."
VARIATION: 3/4 of Scarsdale parents are either good or outstanding. 1/4 are well below average, or bad, or so nasty they have no place in a family livingroom. And yet, they hang out there year after year, and their children pay for their shortcomings and their shortcomings are their parting gift to their children for decades to come.
CONCLUSION: Parents shouldn't have tenure.
THEME: "If we are paying them so much money, you'd think that they'd be in the classroom all the time. What is outrageous is how much classroom time these teachers spend in meetings and training. And substitute teachers without these fancy degrees and extra training are left with our children."
VARIATION: If they care so much about their children, you'd think that they'd be in the home all the time. What is outrageous is how much home time these parents spend in meetings and training. And substitute parents (nannies) without these fancy degrees and extra training are left with their children.
CONCLUSION: Parents shouldn't have tenure.
If changing a few words merely shifts point of view and adds little else, you're dealing with rants, not thoughtful attempts to solve challenging issues. Very discouraging.
1. THEME: "I have kids in all three schools and have talked to many parents. There is not one parent I talk to that does not express frustration over the low performing teachers and keeping them around year after year, wasting our money, but mostly our children's precious youth."
VARIATION: I have been in all three schools and have talked to many teachers. There is not one teacher I talk to that does not express frustration over the low performing parents and keeping them around year after year, wasting their children's precious youth.
CONCLUSION: Parents shouldn't have tenure.
THEME: "3/4 of my kids' teachers are either good or outstanding. 1/4 are well below average, or bad, or so nasty they have no place in a classroom. And yet, they hang out there year after year, and we pay for them and their inflated pensions are their parting gift for decades to come."
VARIATION: 3/4 of Scarsdale parents are either good or outstanding. 1/4 are well below average, or bad, or so nasty they have no place in a family livingroom. And yet, they hang out there year after year, and their children pay for their shortcomings and their shortcomings are their parting gift to their children for decades to come.
CONCLUSION: Parents shouldn't have tenure.
THEME: "If we are paying them so much money, you'd think that they'd be in the classroom all the time. What is outrageous is how much classroom time these teachers spend in meetings and training. And substitute teachers without these fancy degrees and extra training are left with our children."
VARIATION: If they care so much about their children, you'd think that they'd be in the home all the time. What is outrageous is how much home time these parents spend in meetings and training. And substitute parents (nannies) without these fancy degrees and extra training are left with their children.
CONCLUSION: Parents shouldn't have tenure.
If changing a few words merely shifts point of view and adds little else, you're dealing with rants, not thoughtful attempts to solve challenging issues. Very discouraging.
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written by Jane S., November 13, 2011
Many of us whose children have gone through the Scarsdale school system know that you don't always get what you pay for. We just don't want the rest of the world to know it, because there goes our great property values. (High SAT scores most likely have more to do with genes and tutors than with Scarsdale teachers.)
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written by no place to hide, November 13, 2011
Pay the best and hard working teachers even more!! 150K or even 200k a year. Fire the bad ones to pay for the best. Unions were not ment to be used as a cover up for the bad apples. It is true across all professions. We should reward the hard working and DUMP the lazy ones that
use the system for an easy ride to retirment.
use the system for an easy ride to retirment.
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written by Scarsdale Dad, November 11, 2011
People are really mixing apples and oranges here. It is tenure that is causing people to be satisfied with the sub-par teachers that hang on, not teacher salaries. Tenure is a problem that leads to bad teachers being around longer than they should. I wish that tenure did not exist and that teachers needed to perform every year to earn their jobs and salaries, just like people in other professions. Unfortunately tenure needs to dealt with at the state level. It is not a local issue.
Oh and by the way, attacking the free tuition issue for teachers kids is a jok. That is like trying to balance the federal budget by cutting funding for NPR and ignoring the costs of defense and medicaire. It is a red herring. The real issue that is causing our taxes to go up are the state pension mandates, which Governor Cuomo has thur far ignored.
Oh and by the way, attacking the free tuition issue for teachers kids is a jok. That is like trying to balance the federal budget by cutting funding for NPR and ignoring the costs of defense and medicaire. It is a red herring. The real issue that is causing our taxes to go up are the state pension mandates, which Governor Cuomo has thur far ignored.
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written by Just Curious, November 11, 2011
I don't know if being "outnumbered" on an anonymous blog is to be outnumbered in a community that is made up of rational, highly educated people who see the bigger picture, know why they moved here, and know that emotion fueled comments are not additive to a productive public dialogue about education. You should be commended, though, for getting more organized and cleverly feigning community wide representation with your pen names.
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written by A Frustrated Parent, November 10, 2011
Just Curious, you're obviously outnumbered here. I have kids in all three schools and have talked to many parents. There is not one parent I talk to that does not express frustration over the low performing teachers and keeping them around year after year, wasting our money, but mostly our children's precious youth. It's easy to say to someone to get out of here if someone is not happy with the system. As you know, the housing market is very soft. Your children have their friends here. You can't just pick up and go. I have thought about it many times. If there is a problem, we have to try to solve it, not escape it. Tenure system only works for college professors. Quite honestly, it's human nature. If you have an iron bowl, would you still work your ass off to get that bowl of rice? Of course not. Communism doesn't work, so won't tenure.
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written by J Blatt, November 10, 2011
Oh, those rich teachers are just killing us, aren't they? I mean the nerve, creating a world renown public school system and commuting from vast distances to teach the children of the wealthy. Just awful, undeserving people, these teachers. And how dare they have a bottom ten percent, like the rest of our work forces. The incompetence of these awful hiring decisions! Someone should be stoned for that.
I mean, with the genes these kids have, a monkey could teach them physics, and generate these SAT scores, right? I simply don't understand why tons of foreign nationals settle here. I mean really, they must be tuning in to some alternate universe when they decide where to live here for a few years to ensure a superb education for their kids.
And why can't we abolish tenure and still be able to hire excellent teachers while every other district offers tenure? Teachers aren't smart enough to shop around are they? Oh, and tenure is the rule of the state anyway? Who cares? Let's get the tea party in here at once! They'll straighten them bums out!
And free tuition for the employees's kids. Who cares if the marginal cost is a penny a household. You know what Ben Franklin would say!
Yeah, yeah, and yeah. Everybody who runs these schools must be an idiot. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, with the genes these kids have, a monkey could teach them physics, and generate these SAT scores, right? I simply don't understand why tons of foreign nationals settle here. I mean really, they must be tuning in to some alternate universe when they decide where to live here for a few years to ensure a superb education for their kids.
And why can't we abolish tenure and still be able to hire excellent teachers while every other district offers tenure? Teachers aren't smart enough to shop around are they? Oh, and tenure is the rule of the state anyway? Who cares? Let's get the tea party in here at once! They'll straighten them bums out!
And free tuition for the employees's kids. Who cares if the marginal cost is a penny a household. You know what Ben Franklin would say!
Yeah, yeah, and yeah. Everybody who runs these schools must be an idiot. Yeah, yeah.
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written by Quaker Ridge Bobby, November 10, 2011
If you are going to compare teachers to athletes, why not compare apples to oranges? Paying the most does not mean you have the best. We all know there are good and bad teachers in our community. We also know that many parents pay for tutors which props up the results of our students and our district. The socio economic demographics of our community also helps the school results.
It is easy to rationalize paying more, it is harder to do more with less. Isn't our Board and Superintendent supposed to make sure we get the most for the least cost?
We do live in an affluent area but that does not mean we should have little regard for the amount of our taxes.
We also should not be upset with neighbors that would like us to be more efficient.
It is easy to rationalize paying more, it is harder to do more with less. Isn't our Board and Superintendent supposed to make sure we get the most for the least cost?
We do live in an affluent area but that does not mean we should have little regard for the amount of our taxes.
We also should not be upset with neighbors that would like us to be more efficient.
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written by former teacher, November 10, 2011
I don't have a problem with the high salaries, but I do agree that tenure is a problem. Here in Scarsdale, my son's teacher have run the gamut from excellent to "needs to retire." I would love it if parent evaluations could play a greater role, other than for those up for tenure. But seriously, can all the people who live in Scarsdale and earn huge, huge sums of money on Wall St please stop getting so exercised over a teacher's salary of $126K?! I'd like to see you try to live on that salary. Teachers are professionals with advanced degrees who are doing the most important job in the country. But first-year associates at NY law firms make $160K - and what are they really contributing to society? A reality check is in order here. Please read Nick Kristof's op-ed piece (and he lives here in Scarsdale!) because he says it much better than I can. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03...istof.html
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written by GA Mom, November 10, 2011
McGill's argument is spurious comparing professional athletes to teachers. There are only 1696 professional football players who have the job to "entertain" 307 million people in the United States and the rest of the world in reach of cable tv. The 400 odd Scarsdale teachers have the job of educating under 5000 Scarsdale students. It's a ridiculous comparison.
The fact is that these teachers are the highest paid teachers in New York, and we can no longer afford to pay them. The salaries must be cut.
If we are paying them so much money, you'd think that they'd be in the classroom all the time. What is outrageous is how much classroom time these teachers spend in meetings and training. And substitute teachers without these fancy degrees and extra training are left with our children. What adds insult to injury, they declare even more days 1/2 days for teacher training. We don't need more teacher training, we need the teachers to teach our students!!
With the amount we pay them, I would demand that they teach in the classroom every school hour, and that all 1/2 days for teacher training be eliminated. All meeting and training must be scheduled for after 3 p.m. Then maybe, we'd begin to get value for what we pay.
The fact is that these teachers are the highest paid teachers in New York, and we can no longer afford to pay them. The salaries must be cut.
If we are paying them so much money, you'd think that they'd be in the classroom all the time. What is outrageous is how much classroom time these teachers spend in meetings and training. And substitute teachers without these fancy degrees and extra training are left with our children. What adds insult to injury, they declare even more days 1/2 days for teacher training. We don't need more teacher training, we need the teachers to teach our students!!
With the amount we pay them, I would demand that they teach in the classroom every school hour, and that all 1/2 days for teacher training be eliminated. All meeting and training must be scheduled for after 3 p.m. Then maybe, we'd begin to get value for what we pay.
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written by Just Curious, November 09, 2011
Madness - Sorry you're so outraged by your choice to live here. It must be very upsetting to think your investment has not paid off. Are you saying that the teachers who, by your estimation, rate "below average" will become better teachers with lower pay? Or, is it that you will just feel better about making your kids stay in a school with what you believe to be "below average" teachers because it will be less costly to you?
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written by Scott Mills, November 09, 2011
There is nothing worse than when you ge tthe class list and youget the person that everyone knows is the "bad" teacher.
For what they are being paid, and more so what are taxes are we should have year end teacher evalutations!
At the elementary level parents can fill them out, and in high school the kids can evaluate. But the teacher's union may have something to say about this.
For what they are being paid, and more so what are taxes are we should have year end teacher evalutations!
At the elementary level parents can fill them out, and in high school the kids can evaluate. But the teacher's union may have something to say about this.
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written by The Madness of it All, November 09, 2011
Just Curious -- While the grass may not be greener elsewhere, the green surely is showered on our Scarsdale teachers to an absurd degree. If we were truly getting the best teachers and by an appreciable margin, maybe I wouldn't be so outraged by the School Board's endless raising of our property taxes to assure we are the winners of the highest paid teachers in the State and probably the country (maybe even the world). But we are not. We are hamstrung by the administration's inability or lack of desire to pressure the many underperformers to either shape up or ship out. 3/4 of my kids' teachers are either good or outstanding. 1/4 are well below average, or bad, or so nasty they have no place in a classroom. And yet, they hang out there year after year, and we pay for them and their inflated pensions are their parting gift for decades to come. If there's going to be pay for performance, then get rid of tenure.
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written by Just Curious, November 09, 2011
Again, why don't you check out your nearest charter schools? Why all the kvetching about the better for less situation on "the other side" of the fence? If the grass really is greener, you can always go elsewhere and send us all back a gloating letter...
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written by Comparison, November 09, 2011
While Scarsdale has good or relatively 'excellent' teachers, there are average or below-average teachers, as well. Great Neck (shorter commute, on average) and Short Hills should have equvalient levels of teachers vs. Scarsdale, while their tax rates are relatively lower. Net net, we are not paying for the 'Best' teachers...
Recent articles on NY, NJ charter school teachers pay by performance, should prompt us to evaluate the payment systems in Scarsdale schools.
Recent articles on NY, NJ charter school teachers pay by performance, should prompt us to evaluate the payment systems in Scarsdale schools.
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written by Just Curious, November 09, 2011
If you don't want to pay to get the best teachers, why did you move to Scarsdale, which has a national reputation for excellence? There are other communities that pay teachers less, where you could find a bigger home/yard than what you get in Scarsdale for the same amount. If you really think higher teacher pay doesn't get you additional value, then why not act in your perceived economic interest? And, for "Madness," did you call the school to report on the problem that your child reported to you? It's probably more effective than blogging, and don't parents need to be in partnership with the schools in solving problems?
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written by High salary, November 09, 2011
Are Scarsdale teachers the highest paid in NE or in the U.S.A?
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written by The Madness of it All, November 08, 2011
Are Scarsdale's teachers worth a 20 percent premium over Edgemont's. I daresay not. It is completely insane to pay the highest salaries in the State (and probably the country), coupled with an outrageously generous benefits package (including free tuition for out of district kids). Scarsdale must grapple immediately with this problem which is driving long-term Scarsdalians without kids out of town. At the very least, since we offer the highest pay packages, we should eliminate tenure. Some of these old-timers are just milking the system. My kids have had a math teacher who has been around for decades who spends half the class time talking to her credit card companies.
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